A14462:335
A14462:335
The first part of the Christian instruction, and general so[m]me of the doctrine, contained in the holy Scriptures wherein the principal points of the religion are familiarly handled by dialogues, very necessary to be read of all Christians. Translated into English, by John Shute, according to the late copy set forth, by th'author Master Peter Viret. 1565. Overseen and perused, according to the order appointed, by the Queens majesties injunctions.The firste parte of the Christian instruction, and generall so[m]me of the doctrine, conteyned in the holy Scriptures wherein the principall pointes of the religion are familiarly handled by dialogues, very necessary to be read of all Christians. Translated into Englishe, by Iohn Shute, accordyng to the late copy set forth, by th'author Maister Peter Viret. 1565. Ouersene and perused, accordyng to the order appointed, by the Queenes maiesties iniunctions.
London: printed by John Day, 1565London: printed by Iohn Day, 1565
Modern spelling is a reading aid: the words are the author’s, only the spelling is modernized. Original shows the page as printed, with the transcription marks.
T. I Think for all that they have not always the best agreement: of the world among them. D. If there be any discord of opinion among them, it is not commonly for any matter that concerneth the honour of God, the edification of his ⟨p. 148⟩Church, & the salvation of the Christian people: but rather for their ambitions and honours, preeminences, benefices & particular affairs. For in manner all those that come thither, are assured the one of the other, and there is nothing in the world that they have less care for: then for God, & for the honour of his Church, and the salvation of their own souls, & of the Christian people, wherefore in this respect they fear not one an other. For there are seldom any other there, but Scribes & Pharisees, Sadducees & Herodians, Hypocrites and Epicures, Gluttons & Drunkards. Whoremasters & Sodomites, Players & Hunters, with such like, very ignorant in divinity, & of very filthy and detestable life, & should be all excommunicated, & accursed and deprived from their offices, if they should be judge according to the rigour of the ancient Councils, & of their own decrees, which do excommunicate 1& accurse & also judge all such men unworthy, of any Ecclesiastical office. And if there be any other, they are very thin sown. There are very few among them, that are accounted for heretics, as was Joseph of Arimathea in the Council of the Jews, because that he would not consent to the death of Jesus Christ. And if that by adventure there be any one, from whom their happeneth any little word to escape, better 2then from the rest, how little so ever it smell of the smoke of the truth, y• man y• shall have pronounced it, shall be received among them, as Nicodemus was among the Jews, how little a word soever he speak in the favour of Jesus Christ, he shall be in great danger either to be banished from that holy company, & deprived from his benefices, & that at the least, or else if need be: he shall be in danger of the fire: or else to swallow certain pills of a very hard digestion, which shall much annoy his stomach and cause him to loose his voice.
T. I Thincke for all yt they haue not alwayes the best agremen: of the world among them. D. Yf there be any discorde of opinion among thē, it is not cōmonly for any matter that concerneth the honor of God, the edification of hys ⟨p. 148⟩Churche, & the saluacion of the Christian people: but rather for their ambitions and honours, preheminences, benefices & particuler affaires. For in maner al those yt come thyther, are assured the one of the other, and there is nothing in the world that they haue lesse care for: then for God, & for the honor of his Church, and the saluation of their owne soules, & of the Christian people, wherfore in this respecte they feare not one an other. For there are seldome any other there, but Scribes & Phariseis, Saduces & Herodiās, Hipocrites and Epicures, Glottons & Dronckardes. Whoremasters & Sodomites, Players & Hūters, with such like, very ignoraunt in diuinitie, & of very filthy and detestable life, & should be al excōmunicated, & accursed and depriued from their offices, if they should be iudge according to the rigor of the aunciēt Councels, & of their owne decrees, whiche do excōmunicate 1& accursse & also iudge al such men vnworthy, of any Ecclesiasticall office. And if there be any other, they are very thin sowen. There are very few among thē, that are accompted for heretiques, as was Ioseph of Aramathie in the Councel of the Iewes, bycause that he would not consent to ye death of Iesus Christ. And if that by aduenture there be any one, from whom their happeneth any litle word to escape, better 2then frō the rest, how litle so euer it smell of the smoke of the truth, y• man y• shall haue pronounced it, shall be receiued among thē, as Nicodemus was amoong the Iewes, how litle a word soeuer he speake in the fauor of Iesus Christ, he shal be in great daunger either to be banished from yt holy cōpanie, & depriued frō his benefices, & that at the least, or els yf nede be: he shall be in daunger of the fire: or els to swallow certaine pilles of a very hard digestion, whiche shall much anoye his stomacke and cause him to loose his voice.
And I know that there are in the world Godly men, who can testify in deed, how they have wrought in such matters, not many years passed, and can say of all that hath ben done even to this present in the Council of Trent, but how so ever it be, ⟨p. 149⟩if they can not easily agree in their Conclave, and that there be any one that will not forthwith & frankly agree to that which that holy father will have concluded there, the Legates dare boldly say to such as shall stand against it: Conclude as you list, but the matter shall pass in that sort: as it is said that the Cardinal of Monte (which is now remounted by means of the Papacy, and called Pope Julie) did lately at the Council of Trent. And because he was so faithful a Legate, and that he hath not only in that, but in all other things showed him self, worthy of the seat in the which he now sitteth, it hath framed better with him then with others, which have ben esteemed men, of to much honesty to be in such a company, of whom some have been glad to flee, and others have had given them for their recompense, drugs of very hard digestion.
And I know that there are in ye world Godly men, who can testifie in dede, how they haue wrought in such matters, not many yeares passed, and can say of all that hath ben done euen to this present in the Councell of Trent, but how so euer it be, ⟨p. 149⟩if they can not easily agree in their Cōclaue, and that there be any one that will not forthwith & franckly agree to that whiche yt holy father will haue cōcluded there, the Legates dare boldely say to such as shall stand agaynst it: Conclude as you list, but the matter shall passe in that sort: as it is said that the Cardinall of Monte (whiche is now remounted by meanes of the Papacie, and called Pope Iulie) did lately at the Councell of Trent. And bycause he was so faithfull a Legate, and that he hath not onely in that, but in all other thinges shewed him selfe, worthy of the seate in the whiche hee nowe sitteth, it hath framed better with him then with others, whiche haue ben estemed men, of to much honesty to be in such a companie, of whō some haue bene glad to flee, and others haue had gyuen them for theyr recompense, drogues of very hard digestion.
T. Here are very dangerous practises. D. There are yet moe, among the which there is one chiefly that helpeth to bring the conclusion to what pass so ever they pretend, which is not unfitting nor unmeet for their purpose. T. Which is it? D. It is that if the holy father be advertised, that it is to be feared that such conclusion as he would have should be hindered (albeit it be not much to be feared, considering that which hath ben already spoken) he will forthwith make new Bishops as many & more than shall need, to cause the matter to pass more surely on his side, he will take simple Curates, Chaplains, & simple Monks, & he will make them Bishops in hast, the one of Nazareth, the other of Hebron, y• other of Bethlehem, & the other of an other title, & all without any Bishopric, they shall come as thick as flies, to make a non ber of voices: & they shall have pensions & wages of two or three crowns a month, as scholars or soldiers, to entertain ⟨p. 150⟩them, there during the Council. And if the place be anything suspected & not fit for his purpose, & that he have a desire to have the Council put over to some other place, which may be more for his purpose, he will have immediately ready some well learned Physician if need require, who shall have his ready framed reasons, to show how that the air is not good in that place, but it is dangerous to such as shall continue long there, & that it shall be better to appoint some other place, as it was practised not long ago. T. By that that I can understand, all is done there of purpose. The whole is nothing else but a very Comedy or play, in the which the blind are set upon high scaffolds, to lead the blind, & to play their part, according to their scroll & schedule, which is given them. D. Behold here their manner of working.
T. HEre are very daungerous practises. D. There are yet moe, amōg the whiche there is one chiefly that helpeth to bryng the conclusion to what passe so euer they pretend, whiche is not vnsittyng nor vnmeete for their purpose. T. Whiche is it? D. It is that if the holy father be aduertised, that it is to be feared that such conclusion as he would haue should be hindred (albeit yt be not much to be feared, considering yt which hath ben already spoken) he will forthwt make new Bishops as many & more thē shall nede, to cause ye matter to passe more surely on his side, he will take simple Curates, Chapellains, & simple Mooncks, & he will make them Bishops in hast, the one of Nazareth, the other of Hebron, y other of Beethlē, & the other of an other title, & all wtout any Bishopricke, they shal come as thicke as flyes, to make a nō ber of voyces: & they shall haue pensions & wages of two or three crownes a moneth, as scolers or souldiers, to entertayne
T. I Find it very strange, that the Bishops, which be there assembled, as leaders of the blind, & reformers of religion, to direct and instruct the poor Christian people, have need them selves of school masters, & other blind guides, to lead them. D. This doth not agree with that name of a bishop, which they bear 1the which admonisheth them that their office is to be watch men over yt Lords flock. It is not according to that admonition, which S. Paul giveth them, saying, take good heed to your selves, & to the flock, over the which the holy Ghost, hath appointed you watchmen & keepers, to govern & feed yt Church of God, which he hath purchased with his blood. T. They have their worthy answer ready for it: to wit that they be not Bishops of that time, nor such as they were to whom S. Paul spake in this passage: and that they are not appointed by the holy Ghost to feed the flock of Jesus Christ. D. In that thou sayest very truth: for they are feeders & Pastors only to feed them selves, as were the false Pastors of whom the Lord complaineth by Ezekiel. ⟨p. 151⟩2Wherefore they need no great knowledge, nor yet to observe the Decrees & Canons of Pope Hilary the first, of Alexander the ii. of Innocent the vi. of Boniface the iii. of Gelase, & of Zozine, which have ordained that none should be received into any such office, unless he were very wise & known 3to be of good life & doctrine, and yt benefices of the Church should not be given, under pain of cursing, neither for favour nor gifts, nor to any other, then to men of such learning and life as is required for such offices, and that the sheep of Christ must be kept by their own Pastors, and not by hirelings and Vicars. T. We should find a great number accursed, if such Decrees should take place.
T. I Find it very straūge, that the Bishops, which be there assēbled, as leaders of the blind, & reformers of religiō, to direct and instruct the poore Christiā people, haue nede thē selues of scoole masters, & other blind guides, to lead thē. D. This doth not agree wt yt name of a bishop, which they bear 1
D. But we have left the best of the play untouched, which afterward is turned into a Tragedy: to wit, y• Sessions, in the which yt declaration of all the conclusions which they make in the Conclave, is openly published in the Church. T. I pray thee then go through & make an end of the play. D. The day whereon this is done, all they of the town where they are gathered to Council, must make a feast. The Cardinals and Bishops do assist all there, in their sieges & seats, clothed with their robes, & decked as it were bridegrooms. For it is there that the play must be plaid in deed. And for so much as they have had from else where before that time, & not from thence, the inspiration of their holy ghost, & that they be already resolved in that, that they go about, they do not then at all call for their belly divines & hooded men, whom before that time they had for their school masters, but in such sort as they call the rest of the hearers: for there they need them not. Notwithstanding this, to the end that they may give all men to understand, that the determinations which they have brought thither, already framed by them without the spirit of God, ⟨p. 152⟩before that ever they came thither, do proceed from God, and from his holy spirit, they begin with invocation of him, to wit with a fair blasphemy, to outrage the grace of him, and to renounce Jesus Christ our Lord, by whom it is given, for they sing a fair Mass of the holy Ghost, with such ceremonies and so great mockeries, and foolish toys, that the little children would be ashamed to see it. For the Mass must be Episcopal, now there are many mysteries and ceremonies in such Masses, moe then in those that are song by simple Curates and Priests. There is there also harmony, chanting, and great store of Music, even as there was in the solemn feast holden at Babylon, by the commandment of Nebuchadnezzar, to cause his great golden Image to be honoured. There is also a gay and pompous procession, in the which all the players, that play in that play, are clothed and disguised according to the parts that 1they play. Then do they cry out for the holy Ghost (with whom they would not have to do notwithstanding) with very great desire Veni creator spiritus:
D. BUt we haue left the best of the play vntouched, which afterward is turned into a Tragedie: to witte, y Sessions, in the whiche yt declaratiō of all the conclusiōs which they make in ye Cōclaue, is opēly published in ye Church. T. I pray thee thē go thorow & make an end of ye play. D. The day wheron this is done, all they of ye towne where they are gathered to Coūcell, must make a feast. The Cardinals and Bishops doo assiste al there, in their sieges & seates, clothed with their robes, & decked as it were bridegromes. For it is there yt the play must be plaide in deede. And for so much as they haue had frō els where before yt tyme, & not frō thence, the inspiracion of their holy ghost, & that they be already resolued in that, that they go about, they do not then at all cal for their belly diuines & hooded men, whom before yt tyme they had for their scoole masters, but in such sort as they cal the rest of the hearers: for there they nede thē not. Notwithstandyng this, to the end that they may giue all men to vnderstand, that the determinaciōs whiche they haue brought thither, already framed by them without the spirite of God,
to the end that he may come and inspire them, to do that which is all ready done, when this is done, every mans opinion is asked, of those things which are there proponed. Upon the which every man playeth his part, according as he hath learned it, and answereth according to the conclusion, which is all ready made. Those which have better memory then the rest, and do trust thereunto, pronounce their sentence by hart, the others reed it according as it hath ben given them in writing, in the schedules that their school masters, and instructors have made for them. In the which often times there happeneth great inconveniences. For there are some that have so gross heads, and have so evil studied their roll, that they are marvellously troubled to reed it a right. And often times it is seen that diverse of them have one kind of Billet, for so much as one school master hath made them all, & hath given very one theme to his disciples.
to the ende that he may come and inspire them, to do that whiche is all ready done, when this is done, euerye mans opinion is asked, of those thinges whiche are there proponed. Vpon the whiche euery man playeth his part, accordyng as he hath learned it, and aunswereth accordyng to the conclusion, which is al ready made. Those whiche haue better memorie then the rest, and do trust thereunto, pronounce their sentence by hart, the others reede it accordyng as it hath ben gyuen them in writyng, in the cedules that their scoole masters, and instructors haue made for them. In the whiche often tymes there happeneth great inconueniences. For there are some that haue so grose heades, and haue so euill studyed their rolle, yt they are maruelously troubled to reede it a right. And often times it is sene that diuerse of thē haue one kinde of Billet, for so much as one scoole maister hath made them al, & hath geuen verye one theme to hys disciples.
T. IF the worst happen, it can not be denied but that there is great unity of spirit among those men, for so much as they speak all by one spirit. But is there nothing else? D. Those that will make no long discourse, are discharged by one word of two syllables, and a bowed down head, to understand placet, which signifieth, it pleaseth me: For if there were one syllable more, which should be displicet, signifying it displeaseth me, the answer would be very perilous. When this is concluded, the holy ghost, without whose counsel they have determined and done all that ever they would, and whom they have grievously offended and blasphemed, hath notwithstanding determined and concluded all those things, according to their sayings. Wherefore they must be accounted even as though they had proceeded from the mouth of God. And if there be any one that will say against it, he is excommunicated, anathematised, and accursed. Therefore, when their sentence and final conclusion is in this sort published, they then frame the form of their excommunications, anathematisations, and cursings, wherewith they thunder and lighten horribly against all their enemies. And not being contented with that, to the end that their thunderings and lightnings should not seem to be without virtue and force, men must come to fire and weapons, to maintain and defend these holy determinations. T. This manner of proceeding is very meet and worthy of such men as do embrace it. D. Yet notwithstanding it is the very manner & order that they do observe at this present. For it must needs be that after this feast of Nebuchadnezzar, the furnace must be warmed also. T. Then I do not greatly marvel, if that Christendom receive final fruit of such councils, if they be holden in none other sort, there is no great hope to be had of them. D. And good cause why, for their holy ghost is to much burning, ⟨p. 154⟩and of fire greatly different from him that was sent to the Apostles, upon the day of Pentecost. T. Therefore I am well 1content that we leave them, & that we speak of that council of the which we began to talk, and let us see what order was there observed, without any more beholding that Tridentine play, so magical & bloody. D. It shall be the best. T. Seeing that thou art of that opinion, I will not suffer thee to be long at rest, before I return to thee, to hear thee speak of so worthy a matter. D.
I trust by the help of God, it shall not be all together without fruit.
I trust by the helpe of God, it shal not be all together without fruit.
Albeit that the little titles which I make of the principal points which are entreated of in this Dialogue, may sufficiently advertise the readers of those matters that are therein handled, & of the fruit that may come thereof: yet notwithstanding I have thought it good to advertise them in the beginning of every Dialogue, of the effect of every of them, comprehending in general y• which afterward is debated of in particular. Concerning this present Dialogue, I do declare in it in what sort god gave his law to his people, by his servant Moses, & to what end, & how it ought to be used, & what council he held by mean thereof in the mount Sinai, & what things ought to be considered therein. And after that I do show in what sort this general Council doth lead us unto the other which followeth, being holden & celebrated in the mount Zion & in Jerusalem, & how those councils contain in them all such doctrine as is necessary for the church of God. Wherefore I have named it The resolution of the Councils, wherein there is also spoken of the difference & agreement y• is between the old & new testament, the law & the Gospel, & of the ministry of the one & the other, & of the diversity and of the usage of the laws given by Moses. & of his office, and of Jesus Christ.
ALbeit yt the little titles which I make of the principal pointes which are entreated of in this Dialogue, may sufficientlye aduertise the readers of those matters yt are therin handled, & of the fruit that maye come thereof: yet notwtstanding I haue thought it good to aduertise them in the beginning of euery Dialogue, of the effect of euery of them, cōprehending in general y• which afterward is debated of in particular. Concerning this present Dialogue, I do declare in it in what sort god gaue his law to his people, by his seruant Moyses, & to what ende, & how it ought to be vsed, & what councell he helde by meane therof in the mount Synay, & what things ought to be considered therin. And after that I do shew in what sorte thys general Councel doth lead vs vnto ye other which foloweth, being holden & celebrated in the mount Sion & in Ierusalem, & how those councels conteine in them al such doctrine as is necessary for the church of God. Wherfore I haue named it The resolucion of the Councels, wherein there is also spoken of the difference & agrement y• is betwene the olde & new testamēnt, the law & the Gospel, & of the ministerye of the one & the other, & of the diuersity and of the vsage of the lawes geuē by Moyses. & of his office, and of Iesus Christ.