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A peaceable and temperate plea for Pauls presbytery in Scotland, or, A modest and…A peaceable and temperate plea for Pauls presbyterie in Scotland, or, A modest and…Samuel Rutherford, 1642

Chapter 16

pp. 231–26092 passagespart 1 of 3

Modern spelling is a reading aid: the words are the author’s, only the spelling is modernized. Original shows the page as printed, with the transcription marks.

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CHAP. XVI.

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Whether or no it can be demonstrated from Gods Word, that all particular Congregations have of, and within themselves full power of Church-discipline without any subjection to Presbyteries, Synods, or higher Assemblies?

Whether or no it can be demonstrated from Gods Word, that all particular Congregations have of, and within themselves full power of Church-discipline without any subiection to Presbyteries, Synods, or higher Assemblies?

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Very reverend and holy men hold the affirmative part of this question,¹ and deny all subjection of Congregations to Presbyteries and Assemblies. Their first Argument is,

VEry reverend and holy men hold the affirmative part of this question,¹ and deny all subj•ction of Congregations to Presbyteries and Assemblies. Their first Argument is,

1M. B•st Church plea sect. 7. at. 1. and 4. page 68. Parker de Polit. l 3. c. 4.M. B•st Church plea •ect. 7. at. 1. and 4. page 68. Parker de Polit. l 3. c. 4.

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If Churches planted by the Apostles, such as Corinth, have power within themselves to exercise Church-discipline, as to rebuke, excommunicate, loose and relax from excommunication: Then ought not particular Congregations now to stand under any other Ecclesiastical authority out of themselves. ⟨p. 232⟩But the former is true, 1 Cor. 5. 2, 3. So M. Best, Parker, the Separatists, Robinson, Authors of Presb. govern. examined, ¹prove that all believers in Corinth had voice in excommunication.² 1. They amongst whom the fornicator was,³ they who were puffed up, and sorrowed not that he was not cut off, they were to be gathered together in one, and to judge and excommunicate, v. 12. but the fornicator was not amongst the Elders only, but amongst all the believers, neither were the Elders only puffed up, nor did they only not sorrow that the incestuous man was not cut off, but the believers also were puffed up, and did not sorrow that he was not cut •ff, Ergo, all the believers had voices in judging and excommunicating. 2. Of old not the Levites only were to purge out the leaven, but all Israel also, Ergo; here not the Elders only are to purge out this leaven. 3. Paul writeth not to the Elders only, not to be mixed with the fornicators, but to all the faithful. 4. The faithful, and not the Elders only were to forgive, 2 Cor. 2.

If Churches planted by the Apostles, such as Corinth, have power within themselves to exercise Church-discipline, as to rebuke, excommunicate, loose and relaxe from excommunication: Then ought not particular Congregations now to stand under any other Ecclesiastical authority out of themselves. ⟨p. 232⟩But the former is true, 1 Cor. 5. 2, 3. So M. Best, Parker, the Separatists, Robinson, Authors of Presb. govern. examined, ¹prove that all beleevers in Corinth had voice in excommunication.² 1. They amongst whom the fornicator was,³ they who were puffed up, and sorrowed not that he was not cut off, they were to be gathered together in one, and to iudge and excommunicate, v. 12. but the fornicator was not amongst the Elders only, but amongst all the beleevers, neither were the Elders onely pussed up, nor did they onely not sorrow that the incestuous man was not cut off, but the bel•evers also were puffed up, and did not sorrow that he was not cut •ff, Ergo, all the beleevers had voices in iudging and excommunicating. 2. Of old not the Levites onely were to purge out the leaven, but all Israel also, Ergo; here not the Elders only are to purge out this leaven. 3. Paul writeth not to the Elders onely, not to be mixed with the fornicators, but to all the faithfull. 4. The faithfull, and not the Elders only were to forgive, 2 Cor. 2.

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Answ. I will first answer these reasons, and withal show how the people had hand in excommunication, and might prove that there was a Presbytery of many Pastors at Corinth, and not a single Congregation of one Pastor, and some few Elders and believers, who did excommunicate. I retort these Arguments: These with whom the fornicator did converse, and so leavened them, these who were pus•ed up, and sorrowed not at the mans fall, and at his not being cut off by excommunication, these were judicially to excommunicate with the Elders: But the fornicator conversed amongst believing women and children, and did leaven them, believing women and children were puffed up and sorrowed not, Ergo, Believing women and children did judicially excommunicate, but the conclusion is foul, and against the Argumentators, Ergo, so must some of the premisses be foul and false, but the assumption is most true; therefore their major proposition must be false; therefore they must first acknowledge a representative Church with us, and that men only did judicially ⟨p. 233⟩excommunicate, and not all the faithful, except they make women ordinary Judges usurping the authority over men. Then the number of these who were puffed up, and sorrowed not at his fall, &c. must be more then the number of the persons who should judicially excommunicate.

Answ. I will first answer these reasons, and withall shew how the people had hand in excommunication, and might prove that there was a Presbytery of many Pastors at Corinth, and not a single Congregation of one Pastor, and some few Elders and beleevers, who did excommunicate. I retort these Arguments: These with whom the fornicator did converse, and so leavened them, these who were pus•ed up, and sorrowed not at the mans fall, and at his not being cut off by excommunication, these were judicially to excommunicate with the Elders: But the fornicator conversed amongst beleeving women and children, and did leaven them, beleeving women and children were puffed up and sorrowed not, Ergo, Beleeving women and children did judicially excommunicate, but the conclusion is foule, and against the Argumentators, Ergo, so must some of the premisses be foule and false, but the assumption is most true; therefore their major proposition must be false; therfore they must first acknowledge a representative Church with us, and that men onely did judicially ⟨p. 233⟩excommunicate, and not all the faithfull, except they make women ordinary Judges usurping the authority over men. Then the number of these who were puffed up, and sorrowed not at his fall, &c. must be more then the number of the persons who should judicially excommunicate.

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2. The authors of Presbyterial govern.¹ exam. say, Elders are principally to judge, and to be leaders and first actors in excommunicating, and people are to follow in the second room and assent.² So say our Divines, Walleus, ³Bucanus, Rollocus, Beza. Therefore Paul cannot rebuke private believers,⁴ because they did not excommunicate judicially in the first room; for then Paul should have rebuked the Elders and leaders for not excommunicating in the order answerable to their place and power,⁵ and because they did not judicially and authoritatively lead, and go before as first actors and prime moderators in the judicial act of delivering of the man to Satan, and so Paul cannot in reason rebuke all the faithful amongst whom the scandalous man did converse, and who were pus•ed up, and sorrowed not at the mans fall, because they did not excommunicate judicially, at most, they can be rebuked only for not excommunicating in the second room, and in that orderly and subordinate way suitable to their place and power.

2. The authors of Presbyteriall govern.¹ exam. say, Elders are principally to iudge, and to be leaders and first actors in excommunicating, and people are to follow in the second roome and assent.² So say our Divines, Walleus, ³Bucanus, Rollocus, Beza. Therefore Paul cannot rebuke private beleevers,⁴ because they did not excommunicate judicially in the first roome; for then Paul should have rebuked the Elders and leaders for not excommunicating in the order answerable to their place and power,⁵ and because they did not judicially and authoritatively lead, and goe before as first actors and prime moderators in the judiciall act of delivering of the man to Satan, and so Paul cannot in reason rebuke all the faithfull amongst whom the scandalous man did converse, and who were pus•ed up, and sorrowed not at the mans fall, because they did not excommunicate judicially, at most, they can be rebuked onely for not excommunicating in the second roome, and in that orderly and subordinate way sutable to their place and power.

1Pag. 23.
2Ant. Walleus loc. come. p. 1012.Ant. Walleus loc. com. p. 1012.
3Bucan. loc. come. 44. q 13.Bucan. loc. com. 44. q 13.
4Rolloc. come. in 2 Thes. 3.Rolloc. com. in 2 Thes. 3.
5Beza an. may, in 1 Cor. 5. 4.Beza an. mai, in 1 Cor. 5. 4.

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3. I see no foot-step of any tolerable ground in the Text, why it should be alleged that all the faithful men coming to age (to speak nothing of believing women and children) are rebuked for not excommunicating judicially the fornicator; but rather the contrary, that the faithful out of office were not to excommunicate judicially: For applying these words as a reproof to believing men, v. 2. And ye are puffed up, and have not rather sorrowed, that [Greek or Hebrew], to the end that he that hath done this deed, [Greek or Hebrew], may be taken from amongst you. He useth the passive verb, not the active, whereby it appeareth that the believers ⟨p. 234⟩were patients rather, then agents in the not judicial and authoritative taking away of the man from amongst them, and that their fault was that they mo• ned not to God for the mans fall, and the remiss negligence of the Elders, by whose authority he might have been authoritatively delivered to Satan.¹ Pareus saith, that he blameth the believers security; ²Calvin, their not being humbled at the fall, and Cajetan, they boasted that the fornicator was the sinner, not they.

3. I see no foot-step of any tollerable ground in the Text, why it should be alleadged that all the faithfull men comming to age (to speake nothing of beleeving women and children) are rebuked for not excommunicating judicially the fornicator; but rather the contrary, that the faithfull out of office were not to excommunicate judicially: For applying these words as a reproofe to beleeving men, v. 2. And ye are pu•fed up, and have not rather sorrowed, that 〈non-Latin alphabet〉, to the end that he that hath done this deed, 〈non-Latin alphabet〉, may be taken from amongst you. He useth the passive verbe, not the active, whereby it appeareth that the beleevers ⟨p. 234⟩were patients rather, then agents in the not judiciall and authoritative taking away of the man from amongst them, and that their fault was that they mo• ned not to God for the mans fall, and the remisse negligence of the Elders, by whose authority he might have been authoritatively delivered to Satan.¹ Pareus saith, that he blameth the beleevers security; ²Calvin, their not being humbled at the fall, and Cajetan, they boasted that the fornicator was the sinner, not they.

1Pateus come. ib. O•lvin.Pateus com. ib. O•lvin.
2[…]. Jactatis vos incu•pali•es esse. Ju•u• Eccl. l. 2. c. 1, & 9. n. 14.〈…〉. Jactatis vos incu•pali•es esse. Iu•u• Eccl. l. 2. c. 1, & 9. n. 14.

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4. That great Divine Junius doth excellently observe that Paul joineth himself as an extraordinary Elder with the ordinary Eldership of Corinth, v. 4. When you are gathered together with my spirit: For, as I observed before, Paul requireth not only that they be gathered together in the name of Christ, which is required in all meetings for Gods worship in Prayers, Word and Sacraments; but also here he requireth that they meet (saith he) with my spirit, that is, with my Presbyterial power of the keys, and, 1 Cor. 4. 21. with the authority which the Lord hath given us for edification, 2 Cor. 10. 8. as I am an Elder. So said the Prophet to Gehazi, 2 King. 5. 26. went not my spirit with thee, that is, my Prophetical power, Col. 2. 5. For though I be absent in the flesh, yet I am present in spirit. Now the believers out of office did not convene in this meeting, endued with Pauls Ministerial and Pastoral spirit; for single believers receive not Ministerial spirit from God, neither is such a spirit promised to them: Give an instance in Scripture of this promise, and we shall lose this cause; but this spirit for doctrine and discipline so given to Pastors, 1 Cor. 4. 21. 2 Cor. 10. 8. Col. 4. 17. 2 Cor. 4. 1. 2 Cor. 5. 18. 1 Cor. 12 28, 29. v. 17. therefore the coming together with Pauls spirit, that is, with his ministerial power of the keys, as an Elder, must be restrained to the Eldership of Corinth, and cannot be applied to single believers, men, women and children, who yet were puffed up and sorrowed not, v 2. therefore this is not a gathering together of an independent Congregation ⟨p. 235⟩of believers, men and women meeting with Pauls spirit, and his presbyterial power of the keys in an authoritative and judicial way to excommunicate, but it must be a gathering together of these who had such a spirit and power pastoral and ministerial, as Paul had.

4. That great Divine Junius doth excellently observe that Paul ioyneth himselfe as an extraordinary Elder with the ordinary Eldership of Corinth, v. 4. When you are gathered together with my spirit: For, as I observed before, Paul requireth not only that they be gathered together in the name of Christ, which is required in all meetings for Gods worship in Prayers, Word and Sacraments; but also here he requireth that they meet (saith he) with my spirit, that is, with my Presbyteriall power of the keyes, and, 1 Cor. 4. 21. with the authority which the Lord hath given us for edification, 2 Cor. 10. 8. as I am an Elder. So said the Prophet to Gehazi, 2 King. 5. 26. went not my spirit with thee, that is, my Propheticall power, Col. 2. 5. For though I be absent in the •lesh, yet I am present in spirit. Now the beleevers out of office did not convene in this meeting, indued with Pauls Ministeriall and Pastorall spirit; for single beleevers receive not Ministeriall spirit from God, neither is such a spirit promised to them: Give an instance in Scripture of this promise, and we shall lose this cause; but this spirit for doctrine and discipline so given to Pastors, 1 Cor. 4. 21. 2 Cor. 10. 8. Col. 4. 17. 2 Cor. 4. 1. 2 Cor. 5. 18. 1 Cor. 12 28, 29. v. 17. therfore the comming together with Pauls spirit, that is, with his ministeriall power of the keyes, as an Elder, must be restrained to the Eldership of Corinth, and cannot be applyed to single beleevers, men, women and children, who yet were puffed up and sorrowed not, v 2. therefore this is not a gathering together of an independent Congregation ⟨p. 235⟩of beleevers, men and women meeting with Pauls spirit, and his presbyteriall power of the keyes in an authoritative and judiciall way to excommunicate, but it must be a gathering together of these who had such a spirit and power pastorall and ministeriall, as Paul had.

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I deny not but the faithful convened, or were to convene in this meeting with the Eldership, for praying and hearing the word preached, which must be conjoined with excommunication, but the meeting is denominated pastoral and presbyterial with spiritual power from the special intended end in that act, which was authoritatively to deliver the fornicator to Satan, ¹and Ursine thinketh not without reason that the man was excommunicated, and there being a space intervening betwixt Pauls writing of the first, and his second Epistle to the Corinthians, that Paul, 2 Cor. 2. writeth for relaxing him from the sentence of excommunication. Also Paul when he saith, [Greek or Hebrew], I have already judged as present, meaneth not a popular or private judging, as we say, the Physician judgeth of the disease by the pulse,² and the Geometer judgeth of figures, as Marsilius speaketh, but understandeth a joint authoritative judging with the Eldership, otherwayes he needed not to add (but present in spirit, as if I were present, have already judged) for whither he had been absent or present, he might have given his private mind of the due demerit of so scandalous a sin.

I deny not but the faithfull conveened, or were to conveene in this meeting with the Eldership, for praying and hearing the word preached, which must be conjoyned with excommunication, but the meeting is denominated pastorall and presbyteriall with spirituall power from the speciall intended end in that act, which was authoritatively to deliver the fornicatour to Satan, ¹and Vrsine thinketh not without reason that the man was excommunicated, and there being a space interveening betwixt Pauls writing of the first, and his second Epistle to the Corinthians, that Paul, 2 Cor. 2. writeth for relaxing him from the sentence of excommunication. Also Paul when he saith, 〈non-Latin alphabet〉, I have already iudged as present, meaneth not a popular or private judging, as we say, the Physitian judgeth of the disease by the pulse,² and the Geometer judgeth of figures, as Marsilius speaketh, but understandeth a joynt authoritive judging with the Eldership, otherwayes he needed not to adde (but present in spirit, as if I were present, have already iudged) for whither hee had beene absent or present, hee might have given his private minde of the due demerit of so scandalous a sinne.

1V••• in exp• Ca•e. de excom.
2Marsil. pata. p dict 1 c. 2.

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5. The main thing that our brethren rest much on, is that one command of delivering to Satan, v. 4. and purging out the old leaven, v. 7. and the word of judging that Paul taketh to himself, v. 4. is given, v. 12. to all believers, and to all that he writeth unto; but Paul would not say they command the believers to do that which they had no authority and power from Christ to do, if all believers had not power judicially to excommunicate. But I answer, beside that this is to bring in a popular government in Gods house; they ⟨p. 236⟩consider not that they presuppose as granted, what we justly deny, that all and every verse of this chapter is spoken jointly and equally to all both Elders and people, which cannot in reason be said, as in other parts of the epistle, where sometimes he speaketh of all, as 1 Cor. 1. 1, 4, 5. both pastors and people, sometimes of the people, 1 Cor. 1. 12. 1 Cor. 4. 1. sometimes of teachers only, 1 Cor. 3. 12. 1 Cor. 4. 2. 2. One and the same word [Greek or Hebrew], to purge out the leaven, v. 7. applied to both Elders and believers have divers meanings, according as it is applied to divers subjects, so that the Elders did excommunicate, and purge out one way, that is authoritatively and with Pauls spirit, and ministerial power; I mean that same power in kind and speech that was in Paul was in the Elders, for Paul was no Prelate above other pastors, and the people did purge out the leaven another way, by a popular consenting that he should be excommunicate, and this is well grounded on Scripture, see Acts 4. 27, 28. Herod, Pilate, Gentiles and Jews crucified Christ; now it is certain they did not crucify him one and the same way, Pilate judicially, the people of the Jews in a popular way of asking and consenting crucified him, so 1 Sam. 12. 18. All the people greatly feared the Lord, and Samuel; that same verb [Greek or Hebrew] jara, to fear, expresseth both the peoples fearing of God, which is a religious fear commanded in the first Commandment, and due to God only, and the peoples fearing of Samuel, which civill reverence given to Samuel as to a Prophet, is a far inferior fear, and commanded in the •ift Commandment, so Prov. 24. 21. My son fear the Lord and the King, 1 Chro. 29. 20.

5. The maine thing that our brethren rest much on, is that one command of delivering to Satan, v. 4. and purging out the old leaven, v. 7. and the word of judging that Paul taketh to himselfe, v. 4. is given, v. 12. to all beleevers, and to all that he writeth unto; but Paul would not say they command the beleevers to doe that which they had no authority and power from Christ to doe, if all beleevers had not power judicially to excommunicate. But I answer, beside that this is to bring in a popular government in Gods house; they ⟨p. 236⟩consider not that they presuppose as granted, what we justly deny, that all and every verse of this chapter is spoken joyntly and equally to all both Elders and people, which cannot in reason be said, as in other parts of the epistle, where sometimes he speaketh of all, as 1 Cor. 1. 1, 4, 5. both pastors and people, sometimes of the people, 1 Cor. 1. 12. 1 Cor. 4. 1. sometimes of teachers only, 1 Cor. 3. 12. 1 Cor. 4. 2. 2. One and the same word 〈non-Latin alphabet〉, to purge out the leaven, v. 7. applied to both Elders and beleevers have divers meanings, according as it is applied to divers subjects, so that the Elders did excommunicate, and purge out one way, that is authoritatively and with Pauls spirit, and ministeriall power; I meane that same power in kinde and speech that was in Paul was in the Elders, for Paul was no Prelate above other pastors, and the people did purge out the leaven another way, by a popular consenting that he should be excommunicate, and this is well grounded on Scripture, see Acts 4. 27, 28. Herod, Pilate, Gentiles and Iewes crucified Christ; now it is certaine they did not cruci•ie him one and the same way, Pilate judicially, the people of the Iewes in a popular way of asking and consenting crucified him, so 1 Sam. 12. 18. All the people greatly feared the Lord, and Samuell; that same verbe 〈non-Latin alphabet〉 jara, to fear, expresseth both the peoples fearing of God, which is a religious feare commanded in the first Commandement, and due to God only, and the peoples fearing of Samuell, which civill reverence given to Samuell as to a Prophet, is a farre inferiour feare, and commanded in the ift Commandement, so

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And the people worshipped Jehovah and the King, the verb is [Greek or Hebrew] Shachah, which signifieth to bow and incline the body religiously, but the meaning cannot be, that the people gave one and the same religious worship to God and the King, for that should be idolatry: So howbeit Elders and believers were rebuked for not excommunicating, ⟨p. 237⟩and both commanded to excommunicate and purge out the leaven, it will never follow that both hath one and the same judicial power to excommunicate, but every one should purge out the leaven, according to their place and power; and Israel is commanded to put out the leper; yet the Priest only put him out judicially, and Israel is commanded to put to death the false Prophet, and so to put away evil out of the midst of them, Deut. 13. 5. and yet the Judge did put away evil judicially and authoritatively, and the people as executioners stoning him to death, v. 9, 10. and what I say of excommunicating, that same is said of the authoritative pardoning of the fornicator, 2 Cor. 2. for [Greek or Hebrew],¹ as Ursine observeth, is by authority to confirm their love to him, as Gal. 3. 15. the testament is confirmed, [Greek or Hebrew], and so doth Kemnitius, Calvin and Bullinger ²take the word.

And the people worshipped Jehovah and the King, the verbe is 〈non-Latin alphabet〉 Shachah, which signifieth to bow and encline the body religiously, but the meaning cannot be, that the people gave one and the same religious worship to God and the King, for that should be idolatry: So howbeit Elders and beleevers were rebuked for not excommunicating, ⟨p. 237⟩and both commanded to excommunicate and purge out the leaven, it will never follow that both hath one and the same judiciall power to excommunicate, but every one should purge out the leaven, according to their place and power; and Israel is commanded to put out the leper; yet the Priest only put him out judicially, and Israel is commanded to put to death the false Prophet, and so to put away evill out of the midst of them, Deut. 13. 5. and yet the Judge did put away evill judicially and authoritatively, and the people as executioners stoning him to death, v. 9, 10. and what I say of excommunicating, that same is said of the authoritative pardoning of the fornicatour, 2 Cor. 2. for 〈non-Latin alphabet〉,¹ as Vrsine observeth, is by authority to confirme their love to him, as Gal. 3. 15. the testament is confirmed, 〈non-Latin alphabet〉, and so doth Kemnitius, Calvin and Bullinger ²take the word.

1Urs••t. q. 85. p. 490, art. 3.Vrs••t. q. 85. p. 490, art. 3.
2Kemnitius exam, conc. Trid. de indulg. par. •. p. •9. Calvin con•, ib. Bulling.

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It is also more then evident that the Church of Corinth was not a congregation of believers only, or a congregation with one pastor only, and so not an independent congregation, for there was at Corinth a college of pastors and so a presbytery of Elders, Doctors, teachers and Prophets; for 1. Paul was but a founder of this Church, there were many others that built upon the foundation Christ Jesus, and some built gold and silver, that is good and sound Doctrine, some hay and stubble, ¹1 Cor. 4. 6. And these things, Brethren, I have in a figure trans-ferred to my self, and to Apollo for your sakes, that ye might learn in us, not to think of men above that which is (written:) whence I collect, howbeit Paul, and Apollo and Cephas, were not constantly resident teachers at Corinth, yet there were other pastors there, of whom Paul and Apollo were named as figures, that with the less envy he might rebuke them, and amongst these many teachers, some said this is the best preacher, others said nay, but another preacher liketh my ear better; and so there hath been so many choice pastors there, as the Proverb was true amongst ⟨p. 238⟩them, Wealth maketh wit to waver, which Paul sharply rebuketh as a schism, 1 Cor. 1. 12, 13. 1 Cor: 3. 4, 5. So Paul saith, Though ye have ten thousand and instructors, yet have ye not many •athers, 1 Co•: 4. 15. Then they had amongst them many teachers: And it is 2. clear from 1 Cor. 12. 14, 15, 16, 17, 28, 29, 30. that there were amongst them Apostles, Prophets, Doctors, Governments, or ruling Elders, and that this fault was amongst them, that the higher contemned the lower, which is, as if the eye should say, I have no need of the hand, and that they were not content of that place in Christs body, while as they would all be pastors, and all eyes, and so, where then were the hearing, v. 17. and to these especially Paul directed his rebuke, 1 Cor. 5. because of their neglect of discipline against scandalous persons, not excluding the multitude of believers, who also in their kind deserved to be rebuked. 3. We may see 1 Cor. 14. There was amongst them a good number of Prophets, who both prophesied two or three, after other, by co• •e, and who also by the power of the keys did publicly judge of true and false doctrine, v. 29. which is indeed our presbytery. See v. 1, 2, 3. v. 12, 13. v. 24, 25, 26.

It is also more then evident that the Church of Corinth was not a congregation of believers onely, or a congregation with one pastor only, and so not an independent congregation, for there was at Corinth a colledge of pastors and so a presbytery of Elders, Doctors, teachers and Prophets; for 1. Paul was but a founder of this Church, there were many others that built upon the foundation Christ Jesus, and some built gold and silver, that is good and sound Doctrine, some hay and stubble, ¹1 Cor. 4. 6. And these things, Brethren, I have in a figure trans-ferred to my selfe, and to Apollo for your sakes, that ye might learne in us, not to thinke of men above that which is (written:) whence I collect, howbeit Paul, and Apollo and Cephas, were not constantly resident teachers at Corinth, yet there were other pastors there, of whom Paul and Apollo were named as figures, that with the lesse envy he might rebuke them, and amongst these many teachers, some said this is the best preacher, others said nay, but another preacher liketh my eare better; and so there hath beene so many choise pastours there, as the Proverbe was true amongst ⟨p. 238⟩them, Wealth maketh wit to waver, which Paul sharply rebuketh as a schisme, 1 Cor. 1. 12, 13. 1 Cor: 3. 4, 5. So Paul saith, Though ye have ten thousand and instructors, yet have ye not many •athers, 1 Co•: 4. 15. Then they had amongst them many teachers: And it is 2. cleare from 1 Cor. 12. 14, 15, 16, 17, 28, 29, 30. that there were amongst them Apostles, Prophets, Doctors, Governments, or ruling Elders, and that this fault was amongst them, that the higher contemned the lower, which is, as if the eye should say, I have no need of the hand, and that they were not content of that place in Christs body, while as they would all be pastors, and all eyes, and so, where then were the hearing, v. 17. and to these especially Paul directed his re•uke, 1 Cor. 5. because of their neglect of discipline against scandalous persons, not excluding the multitude of believers, who also in their kind deserved to be rebuked. 3. We may see 1 Cor. 14

11 Cor. 3, 11, 12, 13.

:624p. 238–239

so that it is a wonder to me that any learned men should think that the Church of Corinth was one single and independent congregation, a•d that they met all in one house, where •. the Lord had much people, 2. where we are not to think in such a plentiful harvest of Christ, that so many pastors and teachers, and so many Apostles and Prophets, as there were there, as you may gather from 1 Cor. 14. 24, 31, 32. and so many speaking with divers tongues, so many who wrought miracles, so many who had the gift of discerning, ver. 26, 27. that all these were employed to edify one single congregation, who were all ordinary worshippers of God within the walls of one house, 4. We see how the false Apostles and teachers laboured to make Paul a despised Apostle amongst them, as is clear in the 2 epist. ch. 10. ch. 11. ch. 12. and so their meeting together, 1 Cor. 5. 1 Cor. 11. 1 Cor. ⟨p. 239⟩14. must be expounded of their meeting distributively, not collectively, ¹as though all met in one house; and suppose that the pains of so numerous a company of Prophets should do nothing, but feed one single congregation which meet all in one house,² yet there was here a College of many Pastors, Prophets, Doctors and Elders, who have power of excommunication, so faith Robinson, that there were many Doctors and Teachers in this Church, and proveth it well from 1 Co. 12. for which, see what our own Divines say, as Calvin, Beza, Pareus, Bulling. Martyr. Pelican. ³Pomeran. ⁴So also Chrysost. Theoph. Oecumen. Ambros. Lyra. Caietan. So I think this place thus discussed is much against independent Churches,⁵ and for the presbyteries power.

so that it is a wonder to me that any learned men should think that the Church of Corinth was one single and independent congregation, a•d that they met all in one house, where •. the Lord had much people, 2. where we are not to thinke in such a plentifull harvest of Christ, that so many pastors and teachers, and so many Apostles and Prophets, as there were there, as you may gather from 1 Cor. 14. 24, 31, 32. and so many speaking with divers tongues, so many who wrought miracles, so many who had the gift of discerning, ver. 26, 27. that all these were imployed to edifie one single congregation, who were all ordinary worshippers of God within the walles of one house, 4. We see how the false Apostles and teachers laboured to make Paul a despised Apostle amongst them, as is cleare in the 2 epist. ch. 10. ch. 11. ch. 12. and so their meeting together, 1 Cor. 5. 1 Cor. 11. 1 Cor. ⟨p. 239⟩14. must be expounded of their meeting distributively, not collectively, ¹as though all met in one house; and suppose that the paines of so numerous a company of Prophets should do nothing, but feed one single congregation which meet all in one house,² yet there was here a Colledge of many Pastors, Prophets, Doctors and Elders, who have power of excommunication, so faith Robinson, that there were many Doctors and Teachers in this Church, and proveth it well from 1 Co. 12. for which, see what our own Divines say, as Calvin, Beza, Pareus, Bulling. Martyr. Pelican. ³Pomeran. ⁴So also Chrysost. Theoph. Oecumen. Ambros. Lyra. Caietan. So I thinke this place thus discussed is much against independent Churches,⁵ and for the presbyteries power.

1M. Rolins• against M. Yates, p. 28. Beza a•. in 1 Cor. 12.
2Calvin. Pareus come. in • 1 Cor. 12.Calvin. Pareus com. in • 1 Cor. 12.
3Bulling. Martyr. Pelican. Pomera. come. in 1 Cor. 14.Bulling. Martyr. Pelican. Pomera. com. in 1 Cor. 14.
4Chryso. Theoph. Oec•men. Ambros.
5Lyram 1. Cor. 14. Caiet•.

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2. Suppose [Greek or Hebrew] were applied to the people,¹ I see not what can in reason be said against Vasquez, ²who saith, it will follow only they were created by the consent of the people,³ and a man more to be respected then Vasquez, Fran. Junius saith, that lifting up of the hands may well be meant of Paul and Barnabas their hands. See also Tilen, Calvin, Beza and Bullinger. Ordinary Election ⟨p. 240⟩(saith he) is from this commended, and this form of rite of lifting up of the hands was borrowed from the Grecians, who gave suffrages with lifted up hands. However the peoples free election is hence authorized, which form was used in Cyprian's time,⁴ Quando ipsa (plebs) maximè habeat potestatem, ⁵vel eligendi dignos sacerdotes, vel indignos recusandi, quod & ipsum videmus de divina authoritate descendere, ut sacerdos plebe present sub omnium oculis deligatur, & dignus, atque idoneus publico judicio ac testimonio comprobetur. It is nought that Bellarmine saith, they had not jus eligendi, power of choosing, but jus ferendi testimonium devitâ ac moribus, power to give testimony of the life and conversation of the pastors chosen, but good man he seeth not that this is a power of Election, by Cyprian's testimony, and no power of choosing, which is a contradiction, and so saith Theodoret, avouching this to be the mind of the Council of Nice in an Epistle to the Bishops of Alexandria, ⁶and the first general Council at Constantinople. Only from the time of Frederick the ij. who died, an. 1300. were the people excluded from the power of choosing Pastors and Elders,⁷ and this was the deed of Gregory the ix. as Krantzius reporteth. Vasquez defendeth Illyricus in this, whom Bellarmine refuteth,⁸ It is true some say the election of Alexander the iij. which was four hundred years before, was made by the Cardinals only, without the peoples consent: But 1. What may the Antichrist not d•? his deed is not law. 2. Who can believe such a dreamer as Radevicus, ⁹who allegeth this. Platine (I grant) saith, that Gregory the 7. was chosen 500. years before, by the Cardinals only: But to these I add Gregory was a lawless man,¹⁰ and from lawless facts without the authority of Scriptures and Synods no lawful election, without the consent of the people, can be concluded. But what can be said against Chrysost. Leo and Gregor. Magn.

2. Suppose 〈non-Latin alphabet〉 were applyed to the people,¹ I see not what can in reason be said against Vasquez, ²who saith, it will follow only they were created by the consent of the people,³ and a man more to be respected then Vasquez, Fran. Iunius saith, that lifting up of the hands may well be meant of Paul and Barnabas their hands. See also Tilen, Calvin, Beza and Bullinger. Ordinary Election ⟨p. 240⟩(saith hee) is from this commended, and this forme of rite of lifting up of the hands was borrowed from the Grecians, who gave suffrages with lifted up hands. However the peoples free election is hence authorized, which forme was used in Cyprians time,⁴ Quando ipsa (plebs) maximè habeat potestatem, ⁵vel eligendi dignos sacerdotes, vel indignos recusandi, quod & ipsum videmus de divina authoritate descendere, ut sacerdos plebe presente sub omnium oculis deligatur, & dignus, atque idoneus publico iudicio ac testimonio comprobetur. It is nought that Bellarmine saith, they had not jus eligendi, power of choosing, but jus ferendi testimonium devitâ ac moribus, power to give testimony of the life and conversation of the pastors chosen, but good man he seeth not that this is a power of Election, by Cyprians testimony, and no power of choosing, which is a contradiction, and so saith Theodoret, avouching this to be the minde of the Councell of Nice in an Epistle to the Bishops of Alexandria, ⁶and the first generall Councell at Constantinople. Only from the time of Frederick the ij. who died, ann. 1300. were the people excluded from the power of choosing Pastors and Elders,⁷ and this was the deed of Gregory the ix. as Krantzius reporteth. Vasquez defendeth Illyricus in this, whom Bellarmine refuteth,⁸ It is true some say the election of Alexander the iij. which was foure hundred yeares before, was made by the Cardinals only, without the peoples consent: But 1. What may the Antichrist not d? his deed is not law. 2. Who can beleeve such a dreamer as Radevicus,

1Jun. de cloric. c. 7. n 61.Iun. de cloric. c. 7. n 61.
2T•len. disp 25 de voc. min thes. 15, 16.
3Calvin. comb. Beza. in may ib. Bulling. ib.Calvin. com•b. Beza. in mai ib. Bulling. ib.
4Cyprian l. 1. epist. 4. Bellar.
5Theod, l. 1. c. 9.
6Concil Nice. epist. ad episc. Alexand. Concil. Constantine. Greg •x. i• Missana de electione. Kran•zius l 8. Metrop. c. 3.Concil Nice. epist. ad episc. Alexand. Concil. Constantin•. Greg •x. i• Missana de electione. Kran•zius l 8. Metrop. c. 3.
7Vasquez. in 3. Tho. tom. 3. disp. 244 c. 5. n. 55.
8Radevicus de gest. F••de, 1▪ c. 50.
9Platinai• decret. elect. Greg•r. 7 Chrysost. de sacerdot. l. 3. sol. 14.
10Leo epist. 89. ad episcop. per V•ennensem provinc. Gregor. Mag epist. l 2 c. 69.

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Answ. The first of these seven, to wit, Ephesus was not a particular congregation, but had a presbytery of Elders in it, Act. 20. 17, 36. Paul prayed with them all; this is not said in the word, but of a reasonable good number of persons;¹ Brightman under the name of an Angel, ²he writeth to a college of Angels or Pastors. Bullinger he writeth to many Pastors. Didoclav. proveth by good arguments against Downam his Angel-Prelate that he writeth to a college of Angels in every Church.³ Augustine he speaketh to the Rulers; so saith Gregor. Magnus, ⁴Primasius, Bede, Haymo, Fulk, Perkins, Fox: neither hath one single pastor the power of the keys,⁵ but at the second hand, the believers have it as the prime ministerial fountain of all Church discipline, and so they by our brethren's learning, should have bin principally rebuked.

Answ. The first of these seven, to wit, Ephesus was not a particular congregation, but had a presbytery of Elders in it, Act. 20. 17, 36. Paul prayed with them all; this is not said in the word, but of a reasonable good number of persons;¹ Brightman under the name of an Angell, ²he writeth to a colledge of Angels or Pastors. Bullinger he writeth to many Pastors. Didoclav. proveth by good arguments against Downam his Angell-Prelate that he writeth to a colledge of Angels in every Church.³ Augustine he speaketh to the Rulers; so saith Gregor. Magnus, ⁴Primasius, Beda, Haymo, Fulk, Perkins, Fox: neither hath one single pastor the power of the keyes,⁵ but at the second hand, the beleivers have it as the prime ministeriall fountaine of all Church discipline, and so they by our brethrens learning, should have bin principally rebuked.

1Brightman. Apoc. c. 2.
2Bulling. ib. Didoclav. 11. alta Damasc. p. 132, 133, 135.
3August. hom. 2. in Apoc prapositis eccl•siaram.
4Gregor. mor. in Job l. 34. c. 4.Gregor. mor. in Iob l. 34. c. 4.
5Primasius. Bede. Haymo. Fulk against Rh• mest. Rev. 1. 20. Perkins. Fox.Primasius. Beda. Haymo. Fulk against Rh• mest. Rev. 1. 20. Perkins. Fox.

:637p. 243

4. It is no less loose and weak to allege they are independent Churches, because every Church is reproved for it's own faults; reproof is a sort of censure: What, because the fornicator, 1 Cor 5. is repr• ved for a sin that is scarce named amongst the Gentiles, yea and judged worthy to be excommunicated? shall it hence follow that the fornicator is no member dependent, and in Ecclesiastical subjection to the Church of Corinth? So some of the Corinthians, 1 Cor. 15. 12. are reproved for denying the resurrection; for this was the fault of some, and not of all: But will it follow, these some were no independent parts of the Church of Corinth, but an independent Church by themselves? The faults of remiss discipline may be laid upon a whole National Church in some cases, when it cometh to the notice of the National Church, that such a particular Church faileth in this and this point of discipline; but we teach not that these seven Churches made up one National Church; yet this hindereth not, but parts of an independent and subordinate Church may be rebuked for their faults, and yet remain dependent parts.

4. It is no lesse loose and weake to alleadge they are independent Churches, because every Church is reproved for it's owne faults; reproofe is a sort of censure: What, because the fornicator, 1 Cor 5. is repr• ved for a sinne that is scarce named amongst the Gentiles, yea and iudged worthy to be excommunicated? shall it hence follow that the fornicator is no member dependent, and in Ecclesiasticall subjection to the Church of Corinth? So some of the Corinthians, 1 Cor. 15. 12. are reproved for denying the resurrection; for this was the fault of some, and not of all: But will it follow, these some were no independent parts of the Church of Corinth, but an independent Church by themselves? The faults of remisse discipline may be laid upon a whole Nationall Church in some cases, when it commeth to the notice of the Nationall Church, that such a particular Church faileth in this and this point of discipline; but we teach not that these seven Churches made up one Nationall Church; yet this hindereth not, but parts of an independent and subordinate Church may be rebuked for their faults, and yet remaine dependent parts.

CHAP. XVI.

Whether or no it can be demonstrated from Gods Word, that all particular Congregations have of, and within themselves full power of Church-discipline without any subjection to Presbyteries, Synods, or higher Assemblies?

Whether or no it can be demonstrated from Gods Word, that all particular Congregations have of, and within themselves full power of Church-discipline without any subiection to Presbyteries, Synods, or higher Assemblies?

Reformers309

Puritans1,782

Westminster Assembly24

Evangelicals36

CHAP. XVI.

Whether or no it can be demonstrated from Gods Word, that all particular Congregations have of, and within themselves full power of Church-discipline without any subjection to Presbyteries, Synods, or higher Assemblies?

Whether or no it can be demonstrated from Gods Word, that all particular Congregations have of, and within themselves full power of Church-discipline without any subiection to Presbyteries, Synods, or higher Assemblies?