The second reply of Thomas CartwrightThe second replie of Thomas Cartwright

Now as this interpretation off the A. is directly against the words off Cyprian / directly against his meaning showed forth by practise / and examples: so doth it directly overthrow the whole scope / which Cyprian allegeth those words for: which is / that he might thereby withdraw the churches / from communicating with the ministry of those which had fallen / seeing they might both put them out / and choose other in their places. For if he meant the church should stand by to see who were chosen / and to object against him if need required (albeit not thus much was ever observed of our bishops) tell me who are they Cyprian meant should choose? magistrate there was none / The eldership the D. dare not say / for he trembleth at the very name of it: I dare say his meaning is / to gratify the bishop with this morsel / but it will choke him if he swallow it. It is the portion off a number / and therefore if it could be carried from the church: It must come unto the bishops that dwell round about that church / where the election is to be made. And if the election / and deprivation by Cyprian's mind / be in their hands: how hath the people power to choose / and refuse? For if they would / they could neither deprive the present incumbent / nor depriving him choose another. Any off thes things overthroweth Cyprian's drift / and armeth the people with replies against his exhortation: namely that they communicated with their polluted minister / because it is not in them to depose him / but in the Bishops round about: it is not in them to choose another / but in the Bishops. Therefore his reprehension / and exhortation should have been directed against the bishops / and not against them. And so it is manifest / both by the words / and whole drift off Cyprian: that his judgement was / that by the ordinance off God in Ecclesiastical elections / the consent / and judgment ⟨p. CCXVI⟩off the church is necessary.

Nowe as this interpretation off the A. is directly againste the wordes off Cyprian / directly againste his meaninge shewed forthe by practise / and examples: so dothe yt directly ouerthrowe the whole scope / vvhiche Cyprian alledgeth those wordes for: which is / that he mighte therby vvithdrawe the churches / from communicatinge with the ministerie of those vvhiche had fallen / seinge they mighte bothe put them owte / and chuse other in their places. For if he mente the churche shoulde stande by to see vvho vvere chosen / and to obiecte againste him if neede required (albeit not thus muche was euer obserued of our bishops) tel me who are they Cyprian mēt shoulde chuse? magistrate there was none / The eldershippe the D. dare not saie / for he trembleth at the verie name of it: I dare saie his meaninge is / to gratifie the bishoppe withe this morsell / but yt will choke him if he swallowe yt. Yt is the porcion off a nomber / and therfore if it coulde be caried from the churche: It muste come vnto the bishops that dwell rounde abowte that churche / where the election is to be made. And if the election / and depriuation by Cyprians minde / be in their handes: howe hathe the people powre to chuse / and refuse? For if they woulde / they coulde neither depriue the presente incumbente / nor depriuinge him chuse another. Anye off thes thinges ouerthroweth Cyprians drifte / and armeth the people withe replies againste his exhortacion: namelie that they communicated withe their poluted minister / becawse yt is not in them to depose him / but in the Bishoppes rounde abowte: yt is not in them to chuse another / but in the Bishopps. Therfore his reprehension / and exhortation shoulde haue beene directed againste the bishopps / and not againste them. And so it is manifeste / both by the wordes / and whole drifte off Cyprian: that his iudgemente was / that by the ordinance off God in Ecclesiasticall elections / the consente / and iugemente